Boulos: 'Thinking that the crisis ends after impeachment is an illusion'

Deborah Fogliatto, On the 21 - The Municipal Housing Department (Demhab) was occupied for 29 days by housing rights movements in Porto Alegre, who were evicted last Thursday (11). One day before the repossession, the occupation hosted the public class “The outskirts occupy the city.", with the presence of the national coordinator of the Homeless Workers' Movement (MTST), Guilherme Boulos, for whom the problems observed in the capital of Rio Grande do Sul are similar to those in the rest of the country."

Activist, political scientist, and member of the MTST for 15 years, Boulos spoke, in an exclusive interview with Sul21, about the current political situation, with the recent Senate decision to continue the impeachment process against suspended President Dilma Rousseff (PT), as well as the challenges that social movements will face going forward. In terms of housing policies, the scenario is complicated: "the equation is set up, they want to transform Minha Casa, Minha Vida into a real estate financing program for the middle and upper classes," he pointed out, referring to the government of Michel Temer.

Recently, the DEM and PSDB parties called for Boulos's arrest, accusing him of "inciting crime," which was widely denounced by social movements as an attempt to criminalize the demonstrations. Always critical of the right wing, he faces the issue calmly. "This is the face of the elite in Brazil, not just the economic elite, but this elite of traditional and conservative parties. It doesn't surprise me that they criminalize it. I'd rather face a lawsuit from the DEM or PSDB than receive praise from them," he states.

Sul21 – How does the MTST view the current national political landscape?

William Boulos – Everything indicates that the dispute in the Senate is very difficult to reverse. But to think that the country's political crisis ends after the senators make the final vote on impeachment is an illusion. That was the rotten fish they sold to legitimize the impeachment, especially since what is clearly at stake is democracy, with the installation of a government that received no votes from anyone, but also the coup's agenda. The coup was not done by chance, it was not financed by chance. The Brazilian bourgeoisie doesn't do anything without a reason. This group wanted and bet on this political maneuver to have better conditions to implement a program of total social regression in the country. Labor reform, pension reform, the PEC (Proposed Constitutional Amendment) on the public spending cap, dismantling of public universities, destruction of social programs, with the end of the subsidies that support them. What is at stake is a policy of regression, making the country go back 30 years. To give you an idea, they consider the Constitution an obstacle. If in Brazil being left-wing means defending the Constitution, we are not in a good place. That's because it's a limited Constitution, which doesn't have a strong social emphasis, and yet this has become an obstacle to the rampant capital accumulation they want to promote. This is part of the struggle surrounding the coup. To think that you can implement a program like this in the country without popular resistance is naive. This will continue; a cycle doesn't end with a vote. We've entered a long period of instability, political struggle, and social unrest in Brazil.

"Indeed, there is a brutal threat to public housing policy in Brazil and also an imminent risk of regression."

Sul21 – The struggle for housing, even with little progress in agrarian and urban reform, has seen some improvements in recent governments, with programs like Minha Casa, Minha Vida (My House, My Life). How might this area also be affected?

Boules It's important to clarify that we've always been very critical of the "Minha Casa, Minha Vida" (My House, My Life) program.[The program] It was built with construction companies leading the way, outside of a debate about urban reform and the city, producing generally poorly located and low-quality housing. Even so, the "Minha Casa, Minha Vida" (My House, My Life) program was a reversal of public subsidies for affordable housing, something that hadn't happened in the country before. After the end of the National Housing Bank (BNH), which was also a program full of limitations, the country went 30 years without a housing program. Then came "Minha Casa, Minha Vida," limited, and we criticized that, but ending "Minha Casa, Minha Vida" isn't about confronting its contradictions; it's about destroying whatever housing policy might exist in Brazil, and that would be a tremendous setback. And in that sense, we're going to have to confront this; the interim government has already said it will tamper with subsidies and the use of FGTS (Workers' Severance Indemnity Fund) resources for social policies. The equation is set up; they want to transform "Minha Casa, Minha Vida" into a real estate financing program for the middle and upper classes. That's what has always existed: going to a bank and getting a mortgage with market interest rates. That's not a social program; it's mortgage credit. The state isn't needed for that; the market already does it, already offers it. Indeed, there is a brutal threat to public housing policy in Brazil and also an imminent regression; it will be a challenge for the MTST and the group of movements to wage this fight.

Sul21 – Is it possible to conceive of an ideal housing policy model?

Boules – The ideal wouldn't be a housing policy, but rather an urban policy. The housing problem isn't solved simply by building housing. The "Minha Casa, Minha Vida" (My House, My Life) program is the best example of this, because it has produced about three million homes in seven years, from 2009 to the present. The Brazilian housing deficit in 2008 was 300 million families. The latest data we have available from IBGE (Brazilian Institute of Geography and Statistics) is from 2012, when the MCMV was already three years old and had built about one million houses. And the deficit rose to 800 million. In other words, one million houses were built and the deficit increased. Why? Because it's not enough to just build houses. It's necessary to have an urban policy that curbs real estate speculation, that guarantees the capacity of the public authorities to plan and execute public policy in the city, and that takes this responsibility out of the hands of the market. During that same period, we had a brutal process of real estate speculation. At the same time as we had an unprecedented housing program, cities never produced so many homeless people.

The rate of housing production was lower than the rate of creation of new homeless people, due to real estate speculation, rental inflation, and forced evictions. This is related to an urban policy controlled by private capital. Whoever controls the land controls public policy. Whoever controls the land defines the price of the land and consequently, the price of rent, defines the location where social housing will be built; that is, the issue is not just about building a housing policy, it's about urban reform, building a public land bank, and applying some measures foreseen in the City Statute to confront real estate speculation, with progressive property taxes, expropriation and sanctions, and preventing idle land. There are legal mechanisms that can be used for this.

"The mayor of Porto Alegre and his deputy and mayoral candidate need to understand that the struggle of the homeless in Porto Alegre is here to stay."

Sul21 – Here in Porto Alegre, the way the municipality has been conducting these policies has been heavily criticized, including the occupation of the Demhab building. Can you point to any Brazilian city that might be doing a better job in this regard?

Boules – It's difficult. It's difficult because the logic is simple: the construction sector finances electoral campaigns. The construction sector controls city council seats, holds strategic positions in public urban policy, and shapes the city to its interests. Of course, there are interesting initiatives. Now in São Paulo, under Fernando Haddad's administration, there was a campaign to notify residents of vacant areas, which is the first step towards applying progressive property tax (IPTU). The legislation states: “Vacant areas must be notified by the public authorities. After one year, progressive property tax applies, and after five years with progressive property tax, the public authorities can expropriate the land as a sanction.” This doesn't happen because the first step, which is notification, isn't taken. So, a campaign to notify residents was carried out there. São Paulo's master plan, achieved through social movements, struggle, and organization, had mechanisms to some extent to confront real estate speculation, but these experiences are still very residual, insufficient to confront the size and voracity of real estate capital.

Regarding Porto Alegre, the occupation of Demhab is a prime example. It's a scandal that dozens of people have been here for 28 days and that the Porto Alegre City Hall is unwilling to negotiate and offer alternative housing, treating it like a police matter. Do they think people will just disappear, that they'll just disappear into the sewers? People will continue to exist and will continue to fight. The mayor of Porto Alegre... [José Fortunati] and his deputy and mayoral candidate [Sebastião Melo] They need to understand once and for all that the struggle of the homeless in Porto Alegre is here to stay and that they will have to deal with this situation. Putting riot police in front of the Demhab (Municipal Housing Department) won't solve the problem. They need to negotiate, they need to offer public policies. It's a scandal that after 28 days of occupation, the Porto Alegre City Hall's stance is one of silence. [This interview was given one day before the repossession of the Demhab property. The City Hall's position of not engaging in dialogue with the movements remained the same until the eviction.] 

Sul21 – What is the size of the MTST and what is the movement's current activity?

Boules – The MTST (Homeless Workers' Movement) is currently present in 11 Brazilian states, bringing together around 40 families in occupations and community centers in the peripheries, mainly in the capitals of these states. Next year it will celebrate its 20th anniversary, with its main form of action being occupations in the fight for housing, but it is a movement that is not limited to the issue of housing. The MTST seeks to address urban issues and the fight for the right to the city in an integrated way. Therefore, the fight for housing is associated with the fight for mobility, because when people are pushed further away due to real estate speculation, this means greater distances to work. The fight for housing is associated with the fight for quality public services in the peripheries, because the factor that separates the periphery from the center is related to whether or not certain parts of the city have access to benefits. The MTST seeks to build a critical vision of the city and a fight for urban reform in its actions.

"The root of structural corruption in the Brazilian state is linked to corporate campaign financing."

Sul21 – Does the movement also have a position regarding the need for political reform?

Boules – Of course. The MTST believes there are pending structural reforms in Brazilian society. There is a historical debt of the Brazilian state to the majority of our people. The 13 years of PT (Workers' Party) government did not even come close to settling this debt. From the point of view of popular structural reforms, this was not addressed. A true pact was made, where while those at the bottom gained something from social programs, wage increase policies, and public credit, those at the top lost nothing. They continued to have record profits. This conservative pact came at the cost of not addressing any of the essential issues, such as agrarian reform, urban reform, tax reform, public debt, and, naturally, the political system. If one thing has become clear in recent years, it is that this Brazilian political system is bankrupt. With all its contradictions, Lava Jato also shows this. Let's say that one effective thing that Lava Jato shows is what the Brazilian left has been saying for 20 years: that the root of structural corruption in the Brazilian state is linked to corporate campaign financing, which is the core of this political system—a system that is absolutely permeable and open to economic interests and closed to popular interests and popular participation. That is the face of the Brazilian political system, and it has failed.

There is a brutal crisis of representation. Therefore, there is a need for profound and structural political reform, with radical democracy, which involves closing the irrigation channels that hold public power hostage to economic interests, building more mechanisms for popular participation, plebiscites on essential issues, mechanisms for social control, deliberative councils – not the advisory ones that exist and are just pretty ornaments but decide nothing – and guaranteeing effective representation, such as the participation of women and Black people in Parliament, where there is a brutal distortion. We have less than 10% women in Parliament, and they represent 51% of Brazilian society. Businesspeople, 60% of them are in Parliament, and they represent only 2% of society, so a profound change in the Brazilian political system is necessary. We advocate for this.

"The right wing has run out of arguments, resorting to violence. It's a right wing that prioritizes criminalization as its main method."

Sul21 – How is the MTST (Homeless Workers' Movement) viewing the holding of the Olympic Games and all the controversies surrounding mega-events?

Boules – We believe that these mega-events bring far more of a negative legacy than a positive one. This was the case with the World Cup and is the case with the Olympics. The most direct consequence of the Olympics for the majority of the people of Rio is militarization, real estate speculation, forced evictions, inflation in the cost of living in the city, and the works are very focused, linking the hotel sector, airports, and arenas, which do not essentially serve the majority of the people of Rio. This was the case with the World Cup in most of the host cities, so we are not among those who criticize the Olympic Games simply because Michel Temer went to the Maracanã and thinks that if it were Dilma, it would be fine. We are critical of the perverse effects, but evidently, we also believe that the Olympic Games, under these conditions, amidst a parliamentary coup, have become an opportunity to denounce this coup, and it is important that this denunciation occurs as it has been occurring. They suffered a defeat, they wanted to carry out a shameful act of censorship, and they were defeated. Michel Temer was met with a resounding booing at the Maracanã stadium, and the Olympic Games are undoubtedly a way of denouncing to the international community that there is, in fact, a coup underway in Brazil and that an illegitimate and anti-popular government has been established.

Sul21 – Recently, DEM and PSDB filed lawsuits against you. How did that happen? How are you dealing with it?

Boules "I think this is a portrait of the swamp that the Brazilian right has become. It's a right wing that no longer has arguments, that deals with violence. It's a right wing that works through criminalization as its main method. The coup showed this very clearly. A right wing with a plantation mentality, a patriarchal right wing, a rancid right wing. This is the face of the elite in Brazil, not only the economic elite, but also the elite of traditional and conservative parties. It doesn't surprise me that they criminalize. I'd rather suffer a lawsuit from the DEM or PSDB than receive praise from them. It's perhaps a sign of being on the right track, in the struggle of the MTST, of the People Without Fear Front, which is this initiative that we encourage, of broader unity of struggles at the national level. This is a sign of the organized field of struggle that they have built and that is somehow bothering them. It's certainly a good sign."