Lula in the interview: it will be a government of pacification, focused on the poor; gender and racial parity still in dispute.

By Mauro Lopes

I had the pleasure of being chosen to represent Brasil 247 in Lula's historic interview with independent media on the morning-early afternoon of this Wednesday (19) at a hotel in the south of São Paulo - you can watch the full interview below. 

Yes, it was historic, as it was the meeting of two protagonists of Brazilian society who had been condemned by the powerful and their media to be erased from the map and from the history of the country. In 2016, the consortium of the powerful and conservative media that staged the coup against President Dilma Rousseff decreed the death of the independent media. On April 7, 2018, when Lula was taken to Curitiba as a political prisoner, the same consortium announced his political death. 

Because this Wednesday, in an interview with a truly presidential setting, Lula opened the 2022 political year that should lead him to the Presidency in a meeting with the independent media that defeated all the reactionary media of the country's rich. 

I will not give a detailed account of the following interview. You can watch it or read several highlights in the Brasil 247 series of reports on the event - you can also read the column by the highly competent Helena Chagas, “Lula, a key player in the alliance, corners the PT, signals to the military, and calms the center.".

 What I highlight from the interview and its behind-the-scenes details:

Equal participation of women and Black people in government.

My first question was about gender and racial parity in your future government. I provided a brief context: 1) women and Black people are the two largest majorities in the country; 2) polls indicate that they will give Lula the largest number of votes in the elections, in both absolute and percentage terms; 3) the Black and feminist movements (plus the Indigenous and LGBTI+ movements) are the most dynamic pole of political, social, and cultural struggle in Brazil, with a presence that permeates all organizations, movements, entities, and unions; 4) the PT has a historical commitment to the feminist and anti-racist struggle.

The PT governments left much to be desired regarding the presence of Black people and women as ministers in the top ranks of the party's four administrations, despite all the positive policies adopted – these segments were more object of the policies of what protagonists in administrations.

Of the 99 people who held ministerial positions in Lula's government, only 10 were women, and of those, only three were Black. Only seven were Black men. White men: 82 (81%). In President Dilma's government, there were 122 female ministers, and the proportion did not change. 

Now, while Lula may be on the verge of taking office, the global left-wing landscape is quite different from the beginning of the century: in Germany, Olaf Scholz's social-democratic government has 8 female ministers and 8 male ministers; Gabriel Boric has already announced gender parity in the future Chilean government; Mexico has approved a law guaranteeing gender parity in the Executive, Legislative, and Judicial branches at all three levels of government; the examples are numerous.

I then asked if he could make a public commitment to gender and racial parity in his future government. Lula said he would increase the participation of women, Black people, and Indigenous people in his third government, if elected, but he did not commit to parity or even to minimum percentages of representation.

Well, the issue has been brought to the table. Now, we need to engage in assertive dialogue with the PT and Lula, because Brazil is lagging behind the clock of history regarding this crucial topic.

A government of pacification and focus on the poor.

Lula announced in the interview that he will not lead a war-like government and that the country needs to pacify itself after years of clenched teeth and hatred. But this does not mean apathy or the consolidation of the most unjust income distribution on the planet: the poor will be a priority. "The poor will be in the budget and the rich in the income tax," Lula repeated, in what seems to be an electoral slogan. He announced that national conferences will once again be a structuring element of government programs and policies and stated that there will be a series of processes that will guarantee protagonism for the poor.

Lula is not naive and knows that his government will not be immune to tensions or that the class struggle will be suspended. But he intends to use his ingenuity and skill. 

 Alckmin, Haddad, alliances

Lula has practically sealed the deal: Alckmin will be the vice-presidential candidate, barring some serious political accident. At the end of the interview, he confided in me that the former governor's presence on the ticket is not fundamental for a presidential victory, "but it will be decisive for winning in São Paulo (with Haddad)." People shouldn't underestimate the importance of this: São Paulo: the state's GDP is more than 60% larger than Argentina's GDP and is nothing less than the third largest economy in Latin America. Having the President of the Republic and the Governor of São Paulo allied and aligned is an immense power. Lula added: "we can have São Paulo, Rio, and Minas with allied governors, which will give us unprecedented conditions to negotiate with Congress."

Election debates

During lunch, after the interview, Lula hinted that he might not attend the election debates if they are held in the traditional format: "the debate model doesn't work." He said that the dynamic of one minute for a question, two for an answer, then another minute for rebuttal and counter-rebuttal doesn't allow for any debate at all. 

Debate is not a matter of principle for the conservative media. When Fernando Henrique stopped attending all the debates in 1998, Lula said, "the media remained silent because they had a pact to elect him at all costs." "But," he added, "when I stopped going in 2006, they made a scandal and left an empty seat."

Lula indicated that he is sympathetic to the idea of ​​engaging in dialogue with groups of journalists in individual interviews. As the undisputed leader in the electoral race, he does not want to wear himself out with desperate and aggressive candidates like Bolsonaro, Moro, Ciro, and Doria. 

Only one woman and no black people in the Lula interview.

One observation that seems relevant to me and deserves reflection by the independent media: of the eight journalists, there was only one woman, Laura Capriglione, from Jornalistas Livres (Free Journalists), and no black people. 

I asked Lula about gender and racial parity in his government: and in the independent media? He could have returned the question to us; that would have been acceptable, reasonable. The fact is that the independent media is also a space dominated by white men: the presence of women and Black people is growing, but it is still very small and far from parity. The editorial team of Brasil 247, as you can see in the area... About Us According to the website, the team consists of 24 people: 18 men (only one Black) and 6 women (two Black). There is a long road ahead.

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